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Complaints against Austin Police could be worked out through a new city program focused on mediation. We’ll hear more about what these types of guided conversations to address community concerns could look and sound like.
There is a downtown fixture close to Rainey Street that has somehow avoided becoming yet another Austin skyrise – the IHOP on Cesar Chavez, of course. We’ll hear about the real estate drama behind its longevity and what the future could hold for the building and the land it’s built on.
This week in Texas music history we hear about how the Karnes City country singer, Goldie Hill, struck gold in Nashville and set a precedent for women in country music.
Plus, a conversation with the director of a new documentary on podcasting. The “Age of Audio,” premieres at Austin Film Society this weekend.
The full transcript of this episode of Austin Signal is available on the KUT & KUTX Studio website. The transcript is also available as subtitles or captions on some podcast apps.
Jerry Quijano [00:00:08] Complaints against Austin police could be worked out through a new city program focused on mediation. We’ll hear more about what these types of guided conversations to address community concerns could look and sound like. And there is a downtown fixture close to Rainy Street that has somehow avoided becoming yet another Austin sky rise. Of course, we’re talking about the IHOP on Cesar Chavez. We’ll here about the real estate drama behind its longevity and what the future could hold for the building and the land that it’s built on. That’s coming up on today’s show.
KUT Announcer: Laurie Gallardo [00:00:38] The Austin Signal is a production of KUT News, hosted by Jerry Quijano.
Jerry Quijano [00:00:43] Plus, a conversation with the director of a new documentary on podcasting and the age of audio that’s premiering in town at Austin Film Society this weekend, all of that and more, coming up right here on Austin Signal. Howdy out there, this is Austin Signal, you’re listening on community powered public radio KUT News, we’re glad you’re making us part of your Friday, I’m your host Jerry Kijonol. We will get today’s show started by talking about a new city program that aims to address complaints about Austin police through conversation. As KUT’s Andrew Weber reports, the city’s police oversight office hopes the mediation program bridges gaps between officers and the community.
Andrew Weber [00:01:39] Police complaints run the gamut. They could include anything from excessive force to speeding to slow response times. But a good chunk of the time, Austin Police Oversight fields complaints in which people allege officers were just plain rude to them. And that isn’t against the law. Gail McCant is the director of Austin Police oversight.
Gail McCant [00:01:57] That’s absolutely correct. But for officers, it is a policy violation. There is an expectation that you engage with community members very respectfully.
Andrew Weber [00:02:06] So, the office is starting a new program, one where people who complain and the police officers they file complaints against sit down and talk it out with a third-party mediator. McCant hopes this program will change how people think about cops and how cops engage with Austinites on a day-to-day basis.
Gail McCant [00:02:23] We really want officers to think through this process, be reflective in this process. Be able to accept some constructive feedback from community members related to their engagement and really just be open to the process.
Andrew Weber [00:02:38] The idea for the program stretches back as far as 2018, McCants says, but it’s the direct result of the Austin Police Oversight Act, the voter approved ballot measure from 2023 that aims to increase civilian input and police oversight. Kathy Mitchell helped get that measure passed. She’s happy to see the mediation program get off the ground, but she says it took too long to get here. Mitchell sued the city over what she says was an unnecessary delay, a common stumbling block for reforms tied to the Austin Police Oversight Act.
Kathy Mitchell [00:03:07] There’s no other thing than foot dragging to blame for that. The city could have been much further along much sooner.
Andrew Weber [00:03:15] But Mitchell says progress, slow as it may seem to her, is progress and opening a line of dialog between cops and the community.
Kathy Mitchell [00:03:25] Sometimes all you need is an open and honest conversation, and creating a place to have that open and honest conversation is a good thing.
Andrew Weber [00:03:36] Both Mitchell and McCant say the program has the opportunity to break down some barriers and mend fences between Austin police and the people they protect and serve. I’m Andrew Weber in Austin.
Jerry Quijano [00:03:53] Austin’s skyline has had quite a few alterations over the last decade-plus, but one facade has not faded and has somehow remained strong in the face of so much change right around it. I’m talking of course about the IHOP on Cesar Chavez’s ride off of I-35, but there is a kerfuffle bubbling under the breakfast eatery about the very land that the building is situated on it. For more about that story, we’re speaking with Cody Baird. He covers commercial real estate for the Austin Business Journal. Cody, thanks for coming on the show today. Thanks for having me. So in case our listeners aren’t super familiar, what sort of redevelopment has been happening in the area around that IHOP? So that IHOP, they…
Cody Baird [00:04:32] The area around it specifically has gotten sky-high pretty much. The IHOP itself is almost right next door to what is already the tallest tower in the entire state.
Jerry Quijano [00:04:44] It makes for like a pretty comical scene when you’re driving along and you get close to 35 There’s this tiny little building and then huge buildings everywhere around it
Cody Baird [00:04:52] Oh, yeah, a decade ago, it didn’t stand out that much. But today, when there’s been so much development along Rainy Street, you know, you look at it and it’s just like, wow, why, why hasn’t.
Jerry Quijano [00:05:03] That been redeveloped? Yeah, well, I’m going to ask you that question, but since so much has been going up these big buildings, I am assuming expensive buildings, the land that the IHOP is on, how valuable is that land? I can’t remember the…
Cody Baird [00:05:17] Exact figure. But for tax purposes, it was most recently appraised at about $26.7 million, I believe. And just for reference, market value for properties like that often way exceeds the
Jerry Quijano [00:05:34] value okay okay so again you you asked the question yourself right there how has it remained an IHOP in the face of all this change around it so the the property owner has
Cody Baird [00:05:45] said exactly why it hasn’t been redeveloped. But what we do know is that they’re in default on a loan since 2020. And that can trigger a bunch of things like not being able to get refinancing or new construction loans for any kind of development, which would definitely impact any kind or development there. The other side of it is that the IHOP still has a lease there. I think the IHOP extends through June, 2029 right now.
Jerry Quijano [00:06:15] Okay yeah, I will follow up with some questions about that, but I want to go back to that default loan. Your story kind of brings in the default loan, it says the property is intriguing enough itself, but it also brings in these three characters, these three players in your story. I was wondering, hopefully you can talk a little bit about them. Maybe you start with Nate Paul, I think his name might be most familiar to some of our listeners.
Cody Baird [00:06:39] Yeah, yeah. Pretty much everyone involved in this has some kind of criminal investigation history behind them. Nate Paul, for example, during the 2010s, he was a really high-flying, young real estate investor in Austin, making a lot of ways for getting a lot of really valuable properties in prime locations like the IHOP. In 2019, the FBI rated his office and The ensuing investigation saw him plead guilty last year to a charge of lying to financial institutions.
Jerry Quijano [00:07:19] Okay, so that’s a little bit about Nate Paul. Maybe you tell us about Justin Bain. I believe he’s from Austin as well. Correct, yeah.
Cody Baird [00:07:25] Austin Bain is the sole manager of the creditor that’s trying to foreclose on the property right now. Okay, okay. He’s a commercial real estate pro in Austin, but he was recently arrested on charges of playing a key role in a high-end cocaine distribution enterprise.
Jerry Quijano [00:07:44] And you said he’s the creditor currently, I guess, trying to foreclose on the IHOP? That’s correct. He’s the manager of the creditors. And then prior to that, it was another company? Is that where Brian Hardeman comes in? No, no. So, uh, Brian,
Cody Baird [00:07:59] The creditor is an investment entity that’s led by Brian Hardeman and Justin Bain is listed on Property Records as the manager of it. They purchased a loan from Amplify Credit Union after Nate Paul had defaulted on the loan there.
Jerry Quijano [00:08:18] Okay, so this stems from a recent, or maybe not stems, but the most recent thing is a Chapter 11 bankruptcy case, so there’s been a lot of fighting prior to this recent move. Can you just tell us a little bit of that backstory? Yeah, yeah.
Cody Baird [00:08:35] World-class, Nate Paul’s firm that owns the IHOP, they defaulted on a loan in 2020. And that loan was through Amplify Credit Union. After they default it on the loan, the new creditor led by Brian Hardiman and Justin Bain purchased that debt. So now they’re the creditor. And they’ve been trying to foreclose on this property since 2020. The entire time, each time they’ve… Tried to foreclose on it. World class and Nepal have tried through the courts to prevent the foreclosure. Their attempts keep getting denied by the courts, but for some reason the property just hasn’t made it to the fore closure auction yet. Most recently, it was set to get sold on December 2nd last year. It was set to go to foreclosure auction. I was at the courthouse steps waiting to see what happened. And when it never got sold, I went home and I checked the bankruptcy courts. And that morning, world class, the entity that they have owning it declared chapter 11 bankruptcy. And what that does is that bankruptcy will kind of stall or it’ll halt any foreclosures proceedings.
Jerry Quijano [00:09:57] From going forward, yeah.
Cody Baird [00:09:57] From going forward until they kind of go through that bankruptcy process.
Jerry Quijano [00:10:02] Okay, well we have about a minute left, a little more than that. You mentioned the IHOP having the lease. Can you tell us a little bit about like the future and how secure is their future at that location.
Cody Baird [00:10:14] So they’re secure, at least until 2029. They were originally on a 20 year lease that expired in, I think, 2024. And they have a five year extension options. And 2029 is when that next extension option would kick in. And it’s not clear yet if the whoever owns the property can say, no, we’re not gonna let you exercise that. But they’re at least there till 2029
Jerry Quijano [00:10:39] Cause I learned about a triple net lease in your story. Can you just explain really quickly what that is?
Cody Baird [00:10:44] Yeah, yeah, so that means the IHOP is, they’re really handling all the maintenance, all the taxes for the property, they are paying rent, so it’s, I mean it’s a really good tenant to have there. It’s just kind of, just an IHop instead of having maybe a full office tower or hotel or something there.
Jerry Quijano [00:11:03] OK, well, again, this is the latest story from Cody Baird. He covers commercial real estate for the Austin Business Journal. That’s where you can find this story and more of his reporting. We’ll have more in our show notes for today’s show. Cody, thanks for joining us. Thanks for having me. And thank you out there for tuning in to Austin Signal. We will be back in just a moment. This is Austin Signal, welcome back. A pioneer for women in country music has her birthday this week. For more about her legacy, we of course go to Jason Mellard from the Center for Texas Music History out at Texas State University.
Goldie Hill [00:11:48] She’s a fine singer and a nice girl. Let’s make her feel real welcome here. Miss Goldie Hill.
Jason Mellard [00:12:02] This week in Texas music history, a Karnes City country singer strikes gold in Nashville. On January 11, 1933, country singer Goldie Hill was born outside of Karnes City, Texas. Goldie began playing music as a teenager with her two older brothers, Kinney and Tommy Hill, securing gigs in nearby San Antonio as the Texas Hillbillies, and backing singing cowboy acts like Red River Dave and Big Bill Lister. They gained traction by the early 1950s, catching the ear of honky-tonker Webb Pierce. Pierce invited Goldie and Tommy to join his band on Shreveport’s famed Louisiana Hayride radio show. Riding this wave at just 19 years old, Hill auditioned as a solo singer at Deca Records in Nashville, who had also recently signed Kitty Wells. And in 1952, she released her first single, Why Talk to My Heart.
Goldie Hill [00:12:47] To talk to my
Jason Mellard [00:12:55] The following year, her second record, I Let the Stars Get in My Eyes, an answer song to Slim Willett’s Don’t Let the stars get in your eyes, became a country number one hit. Hill was dubbed the Golden Hillbilly, performing on programs such as Ozark Jubilee, the Grand Ole Opry, and the Country Tune Parade with Ernest Tubb. She married country singer Carl Smith in 1957 and toured with him in the Philip Morris Country Music Show for a few years before largely retiring from the music industry. Although she recorded sporadically in the decades to follow. Her disillusionment with opportunities for women singers led her to find fulfillment away from the spotlight. Hill lived out the remainder of her years on her family ranch before passing away in 2005. Often overlooked for her role in Texas music, Goldie Hill set a precedent for women in country music for years to come.
Goldie Hill [00:13:46] You’ve been gone so long, I couldn’t stay.
Jason Mellard [00:13:49] You can hear music from the Lone Star State 24-7 on the Texas Music Experience at TMX.fm
Jason Mellard [00:13:55] Support for This Week in Texas Music History comes from Brain Audio, maker of a compact portable speaker featuring an internal subwoofer that produces deep bass sound. Engineered in the live music capital of the world, more at BrainAudio.com. That’s B-R-A-N-E audio dot com.
Jerry Quijano [00:14:26] This is Austin Signal, thank you for tuning in. What’s the first podcast that was ever recommended by a friend to you? Was it something from the public radio universe or maybe something from one of your favorite comedians that you still listen to this very day? Well, the story of how podcasts came to be and even the very origin of the word podcast is part of the story in the film Age of Audio directed by Shaun Michael Colon. The movie is screening this Sunday at the Austin Film Society. He’s going to be at the theater for a Q&A following the show. And we’ve got him here now for a few questions on Austin Signal. Shaun, thank you for your time. Oh, thanks for having me. I really appreciate it, Jer. So I know you didn’t set out to make this movie about podcasting. Can you tell us what project were you working on and how did that end up connecting you with some podcasting royalty?
Shaun Michael Colon [00:15:14] I was working on a documentary with this punk rock band and we ended up playing a show and through a series of events I ended up hanging out with Ira Glass at a punk rock show. Which is a weird conflation of two parts of my world I never thought would collide.
Jerry Quijano [00:15:33] That’s a very public radio sentence, you know, hanging out with Ira Glass at a punk rock show. I feel like that’s something you can only hear on the public radio airwaves.
Shaun Michael Colon [00:15:43] I think certain people know how weird those two things coming together can be.
Jerry Quijano [00:15:49] The movie is kind of a mix of the story of podcasts, where the words came from, how things sort of happened. But it also is kind running concurrently with a modern-day podcaster, somebody who’s trying to get their show exposure, and a little bit more listenership. How did that come about? Did you anticipate that you were going to work, that the host’s name is Ronald Young Jr.? Did you anticipated working with him from the beginning, or did that happen as you were making the film?
Shaun Michael Colon [00:16:17] No, the film evolved over about seven years. And I always knew I wanted to do some of the history of podcasting and kind of where it came from and talk about the industry. But I also knew that unless you were someone that was really deep into podcasting, that stuff can get, you know, a little boring.
Jerry Quijano [00:16:33] Yeah, and the weeds for sure.
Shaun Michael Colon [00:16:34] And my first film didn’t really have a primary subject that I followed. And it’s really great for the people who, like I said, that are inside baseball and they really love it. But I really wanted to make a film that you could follow along with, whether or not you cared about podcasting or not. And I think the only way to do that is to tell a human story. And I thing, you know, besides podcasting, which has a very DIY kind of spirit to it, I think since the beginning. I wanted to highlight what it’s like to be an independent creator as one myself. I don’t think you ever make a movie that’s not about yourself. But I’m in that independent creator world and I think it’s important for some people to see the highs and lows of what it can mean to be a successful independent creator. I feel like, especially nowadays more than ever, someone either is a independent creator or a family member or a friend is someone that’s trying to do something like this. So. Just hoping I can tell a story that could connect with the most amount of people.
Jerry Quijano [00:17:35] You mentioned the DIY spirit that runs through all of podcasting. Your story weaves through the origins, the heyday, and gets to the current financially tougher environment that podcasts exist in. Besides that DIY nature, what do you see as some of the connections that link all three of those phases together?
Shaun Michael Colon [00:17:54] I think it’s one of the things about podcasting I think that’s no matter if people are making money off of it or, you know, the early days, I think the thing that runs thread that runs through all of it is that this is a medium that’s not controlled by any company. There are companies that can put money into it, but because of the nature of a technical term RSS, it really is one of the first broad mediums that could be broadcast to so many people that know one company or one country or any One thing that controls it and I think that even though it’s harder I think these days to make money in podcasting for a newcomer and independent The opportunity is still there to reach lots of people without any gatekeepers and that’s for better for worse But I think it’s in a very unique position Unlike almost any other medium that’s existed. Maybe early pirate radio before it all got regulated and such, but…
Jerry Quijano [00:18:58] Let me ask you, I have one last question. Your film was made with support from an Austin Film Society grant. I wanted to know how impactful that was to helping make this project become a reality.
Shaun Michael Colon [00:19:10] Uh, I might get emotional here, but please, please, uh, like, uh, the film, you said this was a seven year project, correct? Yes. And remember in the middle of that was COVID. So we had a lot of, yeah, that’s right. We had a ton of momentum. We did about 35 interviews in, uh. 2019 and we really had a little momentum and then COVID happened and really kind of everything kind of, you know, uh just, you can’t do in-person interviews really anymore at that point. And it really kind of, the film in 2023, early 2023, I felt like had a real possibility of dying on the vine through a host of different financial reasons and just momentum and all those kinds of things. And I had it in me to, one of my editors had worked with grants before and they helped me write up something. And basically they told me, you need to support you know, apply to this awesome film society grant. And when they said that, I think I had seven, no, eight days. I think eight days to get it all together.
Jerry Quijano [00:20:18] Wow
Shaun Michael Colon [00:20:19] And to be honest with you, I really at that point just forgot about it. I put it out of my brain and didn’t even think about it, I was thinking about some crowdfunding and some other kind of things with the next step to try and revive the film and get it into a place. And I think it’s in early September, I came home, wasn’t even thinking about it at all and just saw an email and just, you know, you see those emails and it’s so often as a filmmaker and a creative, those emails are. You know, we regret to inform you.
Jerry Quijano [00:20:49] Yeah, rejection letters, yeah.
Shaun Michael Colon [00:20:50] And, you know, and it’s usually in the first line. So I remember, I don’t even remember opening the email, but the first time was we were excited and I literally fell to my knees and started sobbing. I think I might cry now. It was really, you now, the money is definitely helpful. You know, in the size of a film, it’s not enough to complete a film but it’s enough to keep things moving and it really… Invigorated the film and I think it was the you know I went to some podcast conferences afterwards had some funds to be able to fly out as able to upgrade my computer I was able to have some a little bit of a cash flow to be about to kind of get things up and moving again and that’s where I ended up finding I Went to a podcast conference called resonate and met Ronald Young Jr And really that’s what made the movie come back to life. So it was really from that that spark of that Confidence in the project and also a little bit of financial support that really the film exists now And it just I don’t know if it would have if I hadn’t gotten that from the Austin Film Society
Jerry Quijano [00:21:58] Well, congratulations on completing the film. We’ve been speaking with Shaun Michael Cologne. He is the director of the film, Age of Audio. Its Austin premiere is happening this Sunday at the Austin Film Society. The screening starts at 4.15, and Shaun is gonna stick around after the movie for a Q&A that I’m gonna be moderating. So come on out and join us again this Sunday afternoon, 4. 15. Shaun, I look forward to seeing you there, and thank you for joining us today on Austin Signal. Man, thank you so much, man. I’m looking forward to Sunday. And that’s it for this week of Austin Signal. And there has been a lot happening these past few days. So in case you missed something, reminder, you can find our episodes at kut.org slash signal. And subscribe to the show wherever you listen to your podcast. We would really appreciate it. Rayna Sevilla is our technical director. Kristin Cabrera is our managing producer. And Jimmy Mass is Austin Signal’s show runner. I’m Jerry Quijano. We will talk to you on Monday. Have a great weekend!
This transcript was transcribed by AI, and lightly edited by a human. Accuracy may vary. This text may be revised in the future.
