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Hello.

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Hi, Harvey. This is Audrey and Austin.

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How are you?

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Hi, Audrey. Let me get my system

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ready.

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This is the last episode of our podcast.

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And to end this whole thing, I thought

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I'd go back to the beginning, to the

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root of it.

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So my name is Harvey Molotch.

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I'm now retired, but I

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was a professor for many years at

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New York University, London

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School of Economics and Sociology

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at UC Santa Barbara.

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I mentioned Harvey in Episode five

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that Bill wrote about tech, but I didn't

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mention him by name.

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I called him some sociologist.

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Sorry, Harvey, what.

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Else can I tell you about me?

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Harvey studied cities for decades,

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and one of the things he wondered was.

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Who run cities?

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How do the political factions

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shape up?

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And given who wins

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and who's in charge, what

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are their goals and how do

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they function?

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In the 1970s, Harvey came up

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with a theory, and it was basically that

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the people who run a city are anyone

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who might benefit from population growth,

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from more businesses, more people

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moving to their city.

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That generally makes money for people

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in real estate and business, from

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developers to car dealers and

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the politicians they support.

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If you want to find out what

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a city is all about

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in the sense of the important

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people having something they

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share in common, it's

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to use the city to

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grow the city even

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more.

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The leaders of Austin have been really

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good at this historically.

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They've used the city's low cost of

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living. It's great natural resources,

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Barton Springs.

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It's music to market the city

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and attract more and more people.

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More people need more homes and places

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to shop, benefiting homebuilders,

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landlords, business owners.

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Harvey argues These people are different

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than the people who simply use the city

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as a place to live and work.

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They have a great interest

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in exactly what goes on.

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How many people will be brought in,

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where will the traffic lights be?

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And they operate

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through organizations that they create

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and they influence politicians

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and they stay on

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topic.

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All of these things working together to

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grow and grow and grow a place.

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And one day these ideas came together

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for Harvey and he could boil it down

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to two words.

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I was walking down the street, and I

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think it might have been just like that.

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And I thought, Oh, I got

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it. It's a growth machine.

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That's what all of this is.

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It's a growth machine.

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Harvey was the one who coined this term,

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and Austin isn't the only place with

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a growth machine.

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Harvey lived and worked in Santa Barbara

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for years.

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It's a city on the California coast.

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Beautiful weather, palm trees.

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Its population is about a 10th of

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Austin's.

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But Harvey says, like every U.S.

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city, the growth machine does its job

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and growth wins out.

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There was a visible politics

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of people who were trying

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to restrain growth in development

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piece by piece. No, please don't.

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I'm against widening the freeway and

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your arguments that it will

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bring us more business.

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It's not working for me.

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I'm just here for the palm trees.

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And then even though

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most people are want the palm trees

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and not the freeway, a compromise

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is struck in which the freeway

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gets its wind.

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And it made visible

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to me that the instrumentation

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of the city, even in this

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most beautiful of towns,

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there is a operation

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that can say no to

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growth and development.

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As we heard in episode five, Austin's

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growth machine got tech companies to move

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here starting in the 1950s.

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It started with Texas Instruments and IBM

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and then research centers like MCI and

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Semtech, then Google and Facebook

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or Meta, whatever.

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And at some point the machine started

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fueling itself.

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The machine has done its job

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and extremely well.

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And then after that happens,

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classical economics sets in as

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well as in way anthropology.

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People come because their friends live

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there and everybody talks about

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Austin is wonderful and

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the music scene and all that and the

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university and.

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And more and more and more.

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For the man who came up with the term

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growth machine.

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I had one question.

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Can you turn the whole thing off?

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Should you?

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You can't just turn the spigot

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off. All you can do is influence

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the degree of the flow.

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The deed is done.

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What do we do now?

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What do we do now?

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I'm Audra McGlinchey.

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You're listening to Growth Machine How

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Austin Engineered its housing Market.

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Episode seven Grow

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or Die.

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In 2021, news broke that

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this big international chip making

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company, Samsung, was looking to

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build another factory and it was looking

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in offices in Austin.

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Bloomberg reports Samsung Electronics

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is thinking about spending more than $10

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billion to build a Chipmaking

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plant in the capital city.

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The growth machine was at work,

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according to documents filed with the

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state. Samsung was hoping to get the city

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of Austin to agree to a deal,

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a deal where the company would only pay

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half of its city property taxes,

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meaning Austin would waive almost $90

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million in taxes over five

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years.

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Once the maximum rebate on

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property taxes in exchange for creating

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18-hundred six-figure jobs.

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Austin didn't end up winning that deal.

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It's not clear why whether the city

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was unwilling to offer those tax rebates

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or whether Samsung found someone willing

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to offer more.

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We'll get back to that at the end of this

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episode.

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But Samsung not moving to Austin

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made me wonder, could this

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be turning off the spigot?

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This is an idea that I've heard a lot of

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people talk about in Austin that

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we can lower housing costs by stopping

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people from moving here.

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People have joked about.

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Though I'm not sure that they were joking

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building a fence around the city,

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there used to be these T-shirts you could

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buy that said, Don't move here.

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Don't give any more incentives.

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Why would you incentivize someone to move

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here when we don't?

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They're all saying we have no place to

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put them. We have a lot of people coming.

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In from other states and they're moving

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here to Austin.

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And they're trying to push people out.

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And to me is not fair.

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This is not a supply issue.

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It's a demand issue.

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And the libertarian tech

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bros who want to blame it

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on central city people

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when they are causing the problem by

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stampeding the city with hypergrowth

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and super-high paying jobs.

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It's true. If we could pull a lever

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and reduce demand to

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Austin or greater Austin, there certainly

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would be a calming effect on the housing

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market.

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Jake Wegmann's a professor of real estate

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at UT Austin.

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What he's talking about is the concept

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of degrowth or limiting growth.

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It's the idea that, hey, what if as

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a city, our one goal wasn't just

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to grow, grow, grow.

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A lot of people I talked to cautioned

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against this idea of degrowth.

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They worried that the result could be

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cities that have seen huge economic

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downturns, Rust Belt cities like

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Detroit, where in the mid-twentieth

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century, companies left the city and

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left people without jobs.

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It's a critique of

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growth as this

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thing that must always be pursued

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and in a capitalist economy.

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And the argument would be that

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to achieve true

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ecological sustainability,

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we just simply have to build an economy

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that's not dependent on constant growth.

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And so if you took that idea and applied

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it to a city, then,

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you know, then it might be more of an

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argument about the housing, just as much

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of an argument about stabilizing the

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housing market as it as it is about a

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sustainable ecology.

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I tried to imagine what degrowth could

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look like in a city.

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Jake struggled to come up with an

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example, a time when a city adopted

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a policy to stop its population

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growth or slow it down.

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It's not really what cities do.

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But then he told me about this effort in

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San Francisco in the mid 1980s.

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At the time, San Francisco was

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experiencing this enormous growth in its

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white collar economy.

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The city's economy was changing.

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Its traditional industrial activities

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were withering away and leaving the city.

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But the city was really growing as

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a sort of financial hub, you know,

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insurance, banking,

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those types of industries

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that want to locate in downtown

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office towers.

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And so there was a big boom in office

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building construction.

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People in San Francisco decided they

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wanted to control this growth.

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In 1986, voters there approved

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Proposition M, a law limiting

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how many new office buildings could be

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built downtown each year.

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The bugaboo at the time was

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so-called Manhattan optimization.

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People were worried that the essential

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character of the city as a small

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scale, human scaled city would be eroded

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by these big towers, you know, sort

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of taking over, encroaching

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on residential neighborhoods.

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In one article I read, supporters of

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Proposition M argue that limiting new

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offices would give the city time to focus

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on building more housing, housing

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00:09:51,530 --> 00:09:53,029
for all the people moving to San

286
00:09:53,030 --> 00:09:54,379
Francisco.

287
00:09:54,380 --> 00:09:56,449
But that didn't really happen, at

288
00:09:56,450 --> 00:09:58,819
least not at the scale it needed to.

289
00:09:58,820 --> 00:10:00,379
Decades later, the city has some of the

290
00:10:00,380 --> 00:10:02,840
most expensive housing in the country.

291
00:10:07,610 --> 00:10:09,499
I keep coming up against something Harvey

292
00:10:09,500 --> 00:10:10,069
said.

293
00:10:10,070 --> 00:10:12,859
You can't just turn the spigot

294
00:10:12,860 --> 00:10:13,729
off.

295
00:10:13,730 --> 00:10:15,769
Austin's growth machine was so good at

296
00:10:15,770 --> 00:10:17,419
what it did. We don't really need to

297
00:10:17,420 --> 00:10:19,459
market this place anymore.

298
00:10:19,460 --> 00:10:21,559
I always like to point out that in

299
00:10:21,560 --> 00:10:23,989
the United States of America,

300
00:10:23,990 --> 00:10:26,479
you can move anywhere you want.

301
00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:28,609
And second, companies can

302
00:10:28,610 --> 00:10:30,709
add jobs

303
00:10:30,710 --> 00:10:32,809
as they please, and

304
00:10:32,810 --> 00:10:34,939
people can sell their houses to whomever

305
00:10:34,940 --> 00:10:35,989
they want.

306
00:10:35,990 --> 00:10:37,459
So as long as those three things are

307
00:10:37,460 --> 00:10:38,629
true.

308
00:10:38,630 --> 00:10:40,669
A city is just like awesome is just

309
00:10:40,670 --> 00:10:42,889
really limited in

310
00:10:42,890 --> 00:10:45,319
what it can do on its own to

311
00:10:45,320 --> 00:10:47,269
destroy demand for housing.

312
00:10:47,270 --> 00:10:49,579
Austin used to have to beg companies

313
00:10:49,580 --> 00:10:51,739
to move here. Remember Vic Mathias

314
00:10:51,740 --> 00:10:53,959
weaving a bedsheet across a vacant piece

315
00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:55,069
of land?

316
00:10:55,070 --> 00:10:57,409
And in the 1980s, when Lady Bird Johnson

317
00:10:57,410 --> 00:11:00,019
served quail for breakfast and Ross Perot

318
00:11:00,020 --> 00:11:02,119
offered up his jet to get M.C.

319
00:11:02,120 --> 00:11:03,029
to move here.

320
00:11:03,030 --> 00:11:05,179
We're long past the time when the city of

321
00:11:05,180 --> 00:11:07,489
Austin has to worry about trying

322
00:11:07,490 --> 00:11:10,039
to attract new businesses here.

323
00:11:10,040 --> 00:11:11,629
According to the city's own data, the

324
00:11:11,630 --> 00:11:13,699
last time it gave incentives to a company

325
00:11:13,700 --> 00:11:15,259
was in 2020.

326
00:11:15,260 --> 00:11:17,029
The city gave an electronics company

327
00:11:17,030 --> 00:11:19,219
$25,000 in exchange for

328
00:11:19,220 --> 00:11:21,769
providing 65 jobs.

329
00:11:21,770 --> 00:11:23,569
Mayor Kirk Watson wasn't in office when

330
00:11:23,570 --> 00:11:24,559
that happened.

331
00:11:24,560 --> 00:11:26,059
But I did want to talk to him about

332
00:11:26,060 --> 00:11:27,019
growth.

333
00:11:27,020 --> 00:11:29,209
Do we just grow or die?

334
00:11:29,210 --> 00:11:31,579
Are those the only options?

335
00:11:31,580 --> 00:11:33,259
His office said he wasn't available for

336
00:11:33,260 --> 00:11:34,159
an interview.

337
00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:36,019
Instead, they sent me a four paragraph

338
00:11:36,020 --> 00:11:37,279
response.

339
00:11:37,280 --> 00:11:38,809
In it, the mayor wrote that city

340
00:11:38,810 --> 00:11:40,879
incentives are important,

341
00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:42,829
but it's about what kinds of companies

342
00:11:42,830 --> 00:11:45,169
and jobs we bring to Austin.

343
00:11:45,170 --> 00:11:46,939
I want to note that when Watson was first

344
00:11:46,940 --> 00:11:48,949
mayor in the late nineties, he brought a

345
00:11:48,950 --> 00:11:50,749
lot of tech companies here.

346
00:11:50,750 --> 00:11:52,969
But he said now he's quote unquote,

347
00:11:52,970 --> 00:11:55,129
relentlessly focused on making

348
00:11:55,130 --> 00:11:57,349
sure any new jobs get filled by people

349
00:11:57,350 --> 00:11:59,539
already living here

350
00:11:59,540 --> 00:12:01,609
regardless. Almost 50,000

351
00:12:01,610 --> 00:12:03,859
people moved to the Austin area last

352
00:12:03,860 --> 00:12:06,229
year. How we respond to this population

353
00:12:06,230 --> 00:12:08,689
growth is the other part of the equation,

354
00:12:08,690 --> 00:12:10,849
because how we respond determines who can

355
00:12:10,850 --> 00:12:12,679
afford to live here.

356
00:12:12,680 --> 00:12:14,599
We can't put the growth machine back in

357
00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:15,529
the box.

358
00:12:15,530 --> 00:12:17,779
Maybe we can slow it down, but we can't

359
00:12:17,780 --> 00:12:19,249
turn it off.

360
00:12:19,250 --> 00:12:20,250
So what do we do?

361
00:12:24,700 --> 00:12:26,139
As much as I hear people talk about

362
00:12:26,140 --> 00:12:28,539
limiting demand, how can we get people

363
00:12:28,540 --> 00:12:30,309
to stop moving here?

364
00:12:30,310 --> 00:12:33,069
I also hear people question supply

365
00:12:33,070 --> 00:12:34,779
question the idea that building more

366
00:12:34,780 --> 00:12:37,119
homes will do anything or much

367
00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:39,129
to make housing more affordable.

368
00:12:39,130 --> 00:12:40,929
You keep saying that simply building more

369
00:12:40,930 --> 00:12:42,459
creates affordability.

370
00:12:42,460 --> 00:12:43,929
But you never give us the numbers to

371
00:12:43,930 --> 00:12:46,179
prove it. If you tell a lie big enough

372
00:12:46,180 --> 00:12:47,829
and keep repeating it, people will

373
00:12:47,830 --> 00:12:49,209
eventually come to believe it.

374
00:12:49,210 --> 00:12:51,579
That saying that has been floating around

375
00:12:51,580 --> 00:12:53,639
was coined by Joseph Goebbels.

376
00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:56,139
I don't think it's my responsibility to

377
00:12:56,140 --> 00:12:58,419
find people moving into the city

378
00:12:58,420 --> 00:13:00,609
from California by breaking up my

379
00:13:00,610 --> 00:13:02,949
lot and putting a to use on my light

380
00:13:02,950 --> 00:13:05,199
too. That is not my responsibility.

381
00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:07,299
And I didn't work 31 years for what I've

382
00:13:07,300 --> 00:13:09,879
got today to let that happen.

383
00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:12,549
Okay. My name's Daryl Slusher.

384
00:13:12,550 --> 00:13:16,149
I moved to Austin in 1976

385
00:13:16,150 --> 00:13:18,369
from Houston, a native of Roanoke,

386
00:13:18,370 --> 00:13:19,539
Virginia.

387
00:13:19,540 --> 00:13:20,829
Daryl worked as a journalist and then

388
00:13:20,830 --> 00:13:22,719
later won a seat on the Austin City

389
00:13:22,720 --> 00:13:24,609
Council in the 1990s.

390
00:13:24,610 --> 00:13:26,409
He actually served with Kirk Watson

391
00:13:26,410 --> 00:13:28,419
during his first term as mayor.

392
00:13:28,420 --> 00:13:29,889
Daryl is one of many people in the city

393
00:13:29,890 --> 00:13:32,049
who say increasing supply or building

394
00:13:32,050 --> 00:13:34,239
more housing won't do much to

395
00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:36,099
bring down the price of housing.

396
00:13:36,100 --> 00:13:37,269
I'd say there needs to be a little

397
00:13:37,270 --> 00:13:39,369
skepticism to that

398
00:13:39,370 --> 00:13:40,989
and there seems to be a lot of people

399
00:13:40,990 --> 00:13:43,539
just follow this narrative, but don't

400
00:13:43,540 --> 00:13:45,609
answer those questions like that for me

401
00:13:45,610 --> 00:13:46,610
to provide any examples

402
00:13:48,580 --> 00:13:50,289
of where this strategy has actually

403
00:13:50,290 --> 00:13:52,298
worked to bring affordability.

404
00:13:52,299 --> 00:13:54,279
Daryl says he's skeptical because he just

405
00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:56,439
hasn't seen it happen in Austin.

406
00:13:56,440 --> 00:13:58,509
We were leading the nation in apartment

407
00:13:58,510 --> 00:13:59,529
building there.

408
00:13:59,530 --> 00:14:01,269
Why did that bring affordability?

409
00:14:01,270 --> 00:14:03,369
Daryl's right. Developers are building a

410
00:14:03,370 --> 00:14:05,949
ton of apartments in the Austin area,

411
00:14:05,950 --> 00:14:07,689
in the city and the surrounding suburbs.

412
00:14:07,690 --> 00:14:10,899
One firm estimates there are about 44,000

413
00:14:10,900 --> 00:14:13,689
new apartments being built right now,

414
00:14:13,690 --> 00:14:15,189
according to people who analyze these

415
00:14:15,190 --> 00:14:17,559
numbers. This is the most we've ever

416
00:14:17,560 --> 00:14:19,629
built at once.

417
00:14:19,630 --> 00:14:21,039
But here's the thing.

418
00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:23,169
Rent is going down at least

419
00:14:23,170 --> 00:14:23,739
a little bit.

420
00:14:23,740 --> 00:14:25,989
Okay. Good news. If you rent in Austin,

421
00:14:25,990 --> 00:14:27,879
Price is starting to cool off a little

422
00:14:27,880 --> 00:14:29,589
slowly, but it's happening.

423
00:14:29,590 --> 00:14:31,209
The average price of rent dropped nearly

424
00:14:31,210 --> 00:14:33,189
4% this summer.

425
00:14:33,190 --> 00:14:35,649
Put another way, rents are about $50

426
00:14:35,650 --> 00:14:37,719
a month cheaper than this time last

427
00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:38,799
year.

428
00:14:38,800 --> 00:14:41,049
But the skepticism about housing supply

429
00:14:41,050 --> 00:14:41,889
remains.

430
00:14:41,890 --> 00:14:44,679
It seems to be just that an ideology or

431
00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:46,585
a theory. But nobody can tell me where

432
00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:48,309
this work.

433
00:14:48,310 --> 00:14:50,529
Before I a rate

434
00:14:50,530 --> 00:14:52,389
I'm certain of some market could.

435
00:14:52,390 --> 00:14:54,609
Show that turnover so far really

436
00:14:54,610 --> 00:14:56,859
haven't seen any examples.

437
00:14:56,860 --> 00:14:58,929
So what we find is that

438
00:14:58,930 --> 00:15:01,689
an overwhelming number

439
00:15:01,690 --> 00:15:04,359
of Americans don't think

440
00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:06,519
that an increase to

441
00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:08,739
the region's housing supply will have

442
00:15:08,740 --> 00:15:11,054
any effect on housing prices.

443
00:15:11,055 --> 00:15:13,269
Stan Oklobdzija is a professor of public

444
00:15:13,270 --> 00:15:14,889
policy in New Orleans.

445
00:15:14,890 --> 00:15:16,509
Last year, he and researchers in

446
00:15:16,510 --> 00:15:18,249
California wanted to figure out if

447
00:15:18,250 --> 00:15:20,859
something he had noticed was true,

448
00:15:20,860 --> 00:15:22,929
that Americans believe supply and demand

449
00:15:22,930 --> 00:15:25,329
when it comes to really any commodity,

450
00:15:25,330 --> 00:15:26,859
anything you can buy.

451
00:15:26,860 --> 00:15:28,569
But don't believe it when it comes to

452
00:15:28,570 --> 00:15:29,679
housing.

453
00:15:29,680 --> 00:15:31,479
Yeah, So we were we're curious about that

454
00:15:31,480 --> 00:15:33,249
as well. So we thought maybe people just

455
00:15:33,250 --> 00:15:34,989
aren't really good about reasoning about

456
00:15:34,990 --> 00:15:35,979
markets.

457
00:15:35,980 --> 00:15:37,989
So we decided to ask a bunch of other

458
00:15:37,990 --> 00:15:40,179
questions in the survey

459
00:15:40,180 --> 00:15:42,639
about how they believe markets

460
00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:43,239
for.

461
00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:45,069
Stan and his colleagues surveyed a bunch

462
00:15:45,070 --> 00:15:46,989
of people asking them about various

463
00:15:46,990 --> 00:15:49,029
scenarios where supply and demand might

464
00:15:49,030 --> 00:15:50,679
affect the price of something.

465
00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:53,049
So we asked questions that people

466
00:15:53,050 --> 00:15:54,579
are pretty familiar with.

467
00:15:54,580 --> 00:15:55,959
Consider something that happened at the

468
00:15:55,960 --> 00:15:57,459
beginning of the pandemic.

469
00:15:57,460 --> 00:15:58,929
Remember when supply chains got all

470
00:15:58,930 --> 00:16:01,479
messed up and people who make new cars

471
00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:03,099
couldn't get parts?

472
00:16:03,100 --> 00:16:06,189
Suddenly used cars got really expensive.

473
00:16:06,190 --> 00:16:08,229
Good morning, Tom. COVID 19 is driving

474
00:16:08,230 --> 00:16:09,969
the prices of used cars up, and that

475
00:16:09,970 --> 00:16:12,219
means your used car is rising in value

476
00:16:12,220 --> 00:16:13,929
instead of the other way around.

477
00:16:13,930 --> 00:16:16,179
People correctly reasoned

478
00:16:16,180 --> 00:16:18,579
that a halt in the production

479
00:16:18,580 --> 00:16:21,099
of new cars would cause used car prices

480
00:16:21,100 --> 00:16:21,789
to increase.

481
00:16:21,790 --> 00:16:23,169
Okay, what else?

482
00:16:23,170 --> 00:16:25,629
So we ask questions about a new

483
00:16:25,630 --> 00:16:27,909
fertilizer increasing

484
00:16:27,910 --> 00:16:29,979
grain production yields rate, and what

485
00:16:29,980 --> 00:16:31,749
effect that would have on food prices.

486
00:16:31,750 --> 00:16:34,239
Grain prices go down, people said

487
00:16:34,240 --> 00:16:35,859
it's basic economics.

488
00:16:35,860 --> 00:16:37,539
When more people want something, the

489
00:16:37,540 --> 00:16:39,729
price of that thing goes up unless

490
00:16:39,730 --> 00:16:41,349
someone makes more of that thing.

491
00:16:41,350 --> 00:16:43,689
We ask about a program of job

492
00:16:43,690 --> 00:16:45,339
training for plumbers, for high school

493
00:16:45,340 --> 00:16:46,599
students, right? That's going to increase

494
00:16:46,600 --> 00:16:47,679
the number of plumbers.

495
00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:49,659
And what that will do to the average wage

496
00:16:49,660 --> 00:16:50,349
of a plumber.

497
00:16:50,350 --> 00:16:52,479
More plumbers, less pay.

498
00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:54,069
But then when they get to housing, some

499
00:16:54,070 --> 00:16:56,619
sort of mental switch flips

500
00:16:56,620 --> 00:16:58,779
and all of a sudden

501
00:16:58,780 --> 00:17:00,999
housing supply has no effect

502
00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:02,000
on housing price.

503
00:17:03,640 --> 00:17:06,608
People just don't think housing

504
00:17:06,609 --> 00:17:08,799
is a market like other

505
00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:10,598
commodity markets.

506
00:17:10,599 --> 00:17:13,029
Right. So somehow

507
00:17:13,030 --> 00:17:14,679
housing is different.

508
00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:16,809
The laws of supply and demand don't

509
00:17:16,810 --> 00:17:19,209
apply to housing and housing.

510
00:17:19,210 --> 00:17:21,429
Price inflation is either the result

511
00:17:21,430 --> 00:17:23,699
of. Various actors

512
00:17:23,700 --> 00:17:25,828
off in the market or some

513
00:17:25,829 --> 00:17:27,419
sort of government interference or

514
00:17:27,420 --> 00:17:28,769
something to that effect.

515
00:17:28,770 --> 00:17:30,629
Stan and his fellow researchers weren't

516
00:17:30,630 --> 00:17:32,699
able to figure out why people don't think

517
00:17:32,700 --> 00:17:35,009
supply and demand pertains to housing.

518
00:17:35,010 --> 00:17:36,959
But he said it might be because of how we

519
00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:39,089
see housing prices go up in

520
00:17:39,090 --> 00:17:40,469
our own neighborhoods.

521
00:17:40,470 --> 00:17:42,659
They see new condo

522
00:17:42,660 --> 00:17:45,089
going up. They see prices

523
00:17:45,090 --> 00:17:46,739
on Zillow also going up.

524
00:17:46,740 --> 00:17:48,239
And they pair the two together.

525
00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:50,489
Right. It's like people thinking

526
00:17:50,490 --> 00:17:52,919
that an evacuation causes

527
00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:54,689
hurricanes because they see people

528
00:17:54,690 --> 00:17:56,939
packing up their cars and heading

529
00:17:56,940 --> 00:17:59,009
for higher ground and then a hurricane

530
00:17:59,010 --> 00:17:59,939
comes. Right.

531
00:17:59,940 --> 00:18:02,519
So sort of one causes the other.

532
00:18:02,520 --> 00:18:04,259
Lots of studies have shown that a greater

533
00:18:04,260 --> 00:18:06,539
supply of housing either slows the rise

534
00:18:06,540 --> 00:18:09,419
of housing prices or brings them down.

535
00:18:09,420 --> 00:18:10,589
I'll take one example.

536
00:18:10,590 --> 00:18:13,049
In 2021, a researcher looked at housing

537
00:18:13,050 --> 00:18:14,609
in San Francisco.

538
00:18:14,610 --> 00:18:16,259
She found that when new apartments were

539
00:18:16,260 --> 00:18:18,359
built in a neighborhood, the monthly rent

540
00:18:18,360 --> 00:18:20,639
on nearby apartments went down anywhere

541
00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:23,279
from 1 to 2%,

542
00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:25,139
1 to 2%.

543
00:18:25,140 --> 00:18:27,029
Look, that's not a lot.

544
00:18:27,030 --> 00:18:29,129
If you pay 1600 dollars a month in

545
00:18:29,130 --> 00:18:32,009
rent, which is the average in Austin,

546
00:18:32,010 --> 00:18:34,229
that's a drop of about $32

547
00:18:34,230 --> 00:18:36,359
a month, which is significant

548
00:18:36,360 --> 00:18:38,279
when we consider that just last year,

549
00:18:38,280 --> 00:18:41,609
rents in Austin went up nearly 25%.

550
00:18:41,610 --> 00:18:43,739
But yeah, $30 a month,

551
00:18:43,740 --> 00:18:44,999
not great.

552
00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:47,249
Which brings me to this last point.

553
00:18:47,250 --> 00:18:50,039
That building and building and building

554
00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:52,589
will likely only get us so far.

555
00:18:52,590 --> 00:18:54,269
Here's Jake Wegman again.

556
00:18:54,270 --> 00:18:56,489
The unsatisfying point is

557
00:18:56,490 --> 00:18:59,069
that, Mark reconstruction

558
00:18:59,070 --> 00:19:01,649
is probably a lot better at reducing

559
00:19:01,650 --> 00:19:03,119
the rate of growth than it is and

560
00:19:03,120 --> 00:19:05,009
actually bringing prices down, because if

561
00:19:05,010 --> 00:19:07,199
you bring prices down, then you take

562
00:19:07,200 --> 00:19:09,119
away the incentive for people to to build

563
00:19:09,120 --> 00:19:10,120
things.

564
00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:15,599
Most of the housing in Austin and across

565
00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:17,399
the country is private.

566
00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:19,469
It's built for profit.

567
00:19:19,470 --> 00:19:21,329
You're living in it and someone is making

568
00:19:21,330 --> 00:19:22,439
money off of it.

569
00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:24,809
Maybe that's a landlord, a bank.

570
00:19:24,810 --> 00:19:26,399
You the homeowner.

571
00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:28,019
Capitalism, baby.

572
00:19:28,020 --> 00:19:30,359
And so if housing gets too cheap,

573
00:19:30,360 --> 00:19:32,429
there's less profit to make and less

574
00:19:32,430 --> 00:19:34,170
incentive to build more of it.

575
00:19:37,380 --> 00:19:38,970
So what do we do?

576
00:19:40,500 --> 00:19:42,180
More after the break.

577
00:19:51,520 --> 00:19:53,289
Late last year, I went to this gathering

578
00:19:53,290 --> 00:19:54,939
in East Austin.

579
00:19:54,940 --> 00:19:55,909
It was outdoors.

580
00:19:55,910 --> 00:19:58,119
There were tents, a stage,

581
00:19:58,120 --> 00:20:00,849
bunch of politicians, coffee pastries,

582
00:20:00,850 --> 00:20:02,469
breakfast tacos.

583
00:20:02,470 --> 00:20:04,749
Kind of your typical bureaucratic press

584
00:20:04,750 --> 00:20:05,739
conference.

585
00:20:05,740 --> 00:20:07,539
So tell me where we are right now and why

586
00:20:07,540 --> 00:20:09,039
we're here today.

587
00:20:09,040 --> 00:20:11,229
So today we are

588
00:20:11,230 --> 00:20:14,139
at the Pathways at Rosewood Courts,

589
00:20:14,140 --> 00:20:16,419
at Chicon and Cornell

590
00:20:16,420 --> 00:20:18,129
Streets in East Austin.

591
00:20:18,130 --> 00:20:20,499
And we are here celebrating

592
00:20:20,500 --> 00:20:22,929
the long anticipated, long

593
00:20:22,930 --> 00:20:25,149
awaited groundbreaking for

594
00:20:25,150 --> 00:20:27,189
the Pathways of Rosewood Courts Project.

595
00:20:27,190 --> 00:20:28,719
Rosewood Courts is one of the oldest

596
00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:30,909
public housing complexes, not just

597
00:20:30,910 --> 00:20:33,309
in Austin, but in the country.

598
00:20:33,310 --> 00:20:35,349
And on this day in December, a bunch of

599
00:20:35,350 --> 00:20:37,389
politicians had gathered to make a big

600
00:20:37,390 --> 00:20:38,649
announcement.

601
00:20:38,650 --> 00:20:41,079
Here's former Mayor Steve Adler.

602
00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:42,545
Let me let me first begin by

603
00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:46,869
thanking the residents of Rosewood

604
00:20:46,870 --> 00:20:49,659
courts for inviting the community to

605
00:20:49,660 --> 00:20:51,789
your home today

606
00:20:51,790 --> 00:20:54,549
to be part of this celebration.

607
00:20:54,550 --> 00:20:55,659
Just beyond the tent where the

608
00:20:55,660 --> 00:20:57,459
politicians were speaking were these

609
00:20:57,460 --> 00:20:59,709
barrack style brick homes built just

610
00:20:59,710 --> 00:21:01,599
before World War Two.

611
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:04,329
At the time, this housing was segregated.

612
00:21:04,330 --> 00:21:06,009
Black people lived here at Rosewood

613
00:21:06,010 --> 00:21:08,139
Courts, Hispanic and white people

614
00:21:08,140 --> 00:21:10,329
in other public housing in other parts

615
00:21:10,330 --> 00:21:11,349
of Austin.

616
00:21:11,350 --> 00:21:12,939
But these crumbling brick buildings were

617
00:21:12,940 --> 00:21:15,579
set to be torn down and replaced.

618
00:21:15,580 --> 00:21:16,959
That's what everyone was there to

619
00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:17,769
celebrate.

620
00:21:17,770 --> 00:21:19,299
On the outside, the facades will be

621
00:21:19,300 --> 00:21:21,189
returned to how they looked in the late

622
00:21:21,190 --> 00:21:23,379
1930s the flat roofs, the restored

623
00:21:23,380 --> 00:21:25,929
windows, the original brick

624
00:21:25,930 --> 00:21:27,669
restored to recapture, to really

625
00:21:27,670 --> 00:21:29,979
recapture the beautiful, the beauty of

626
00:21:29,980 --> 00:21:31,419
house architecture.

627
00:21:31,420 --> 00:21:33,369
Then the politicians and bureaucrats,

628
00:21:33,370 --> 00:21:35,409
that thing they do where they take these

629
00:21:35,410 --> 00:21:37,569
fancy shovels and they pretend to shovel

630
00:21:37,570 --> 00:21:39,519
dirt to kick off the building of

631
00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:40,509
something new.

632
00:21:40,510 --> 00:21:42,519
We'll do the ceremonial shoveling of the

633
00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:43,389
first group of dirt.

634
00:21:43,390 --> 00:21:46,029
Public housing is subsidized housing.

635
00:21:46,030 --> 00:21:47,979
The government in this case, typically

636
00:21:47,980 --> 00:21:50,349
the federal government pays or waives

637
00:21:50,350 --> 00:21:52,269
part of someone's rent.

638
00:21:52,270 --> 00:21:54,729
Now, not everyone can get public housing.

639
00:21:54,730 --> 00:21:57,369
You have to earn a pretty low income.

640
00:21:57,370 --> 00:21:59,229
But whatever income you do make, you pay

641
00:21:59,230 --> 00:22:01,299
about a third of it towards your rent.

642
00:22:01,300 --> 00:22:03,999
So if you earn $3,000 a month,

643
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:06,909
900 of that goes to housing.

644
00:22:06,910 --> 00:22:08,799
Like I said at this press conference,

645
00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:10,899
there were local politicians, people

646
00:22:10,900 --> 00:22:13,239
who work for the housing authority.

647
00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:15,729
And then there was Lucy Baines Johnson,

648
00:22:15,730 --> 00:22:18,069
the daughter of former President Lyndon

649
00:22:18,070 --> 00:22:18,909
Johnson.

650
00:22:18,910 --> 00:22:21,579
I remember those wonderful words

651
00:22:21,580 --> 00:22:24,789
of hope that came

652
00:22:24,790 --> 00:22:26,949
from Martin Luther King when

653
00:22:26,950 --> 00:22:28,899
he said, I have a dream.

654
00:22:28,900 --> 00:22:30,879
Before he was vice president and before

655
00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:33,309
he was president, LBJ represented Austin

656
00:22:33,310 --> 00:22:34,389
in Congress.

657
00:22:34,390 --> 00:22:36,819
He worked to get money for public housing

658
00:22:36,820 --> 00:22:39,399
and he brought that money to Austin.

659
00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:41,619
Well, after Lyndon Johnson

660
00:22:41,620 --> 00:22:42,970
walked these grounds

661
00:22:43,990 --> 00:22:46,179
some nearly 80 years ago as a young

662
00:22:46,180 --> 00:22:48,309
congressman, he

663
00:22:48,310 --> 00:22:49,310
had a dream.

664
00:22:50,410 --> 00:22:51,579
He had a purpose.

665
00:22:52,810 --> 00:22:55,479
And all I can tell you is

666
00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:58,359
when the roll is called up yonder

667
00:22:58,360 --> 00:23:01,059
over on the other shore,

668
00:23:01,060 --> 00:23:03,189
I hope you remember

669
00:23:03,190 --> 00:23:04,300
how much he cared,

670
00:23:05,350 --> 00:23:07,419
how hard he tried.

671
00:23:07,420 --> 00:23:08,889
The government began funding public

672
00:23:08,890 --> 00:23:11,049
housing in the 1930s because

673
00:23:11,050 --> 00:23:12,609
there was a shortage of housing for

674
00:23:12,610 --> 00:23:15,249
families who didn't earn a ton of money.

675
00:23:15,250 --> 00:23:16,869
More and more, they couldn't afford

676
00:23:16,870 --> 00:23:18,549
private housing.

677
00:23:18,550 --> 00:23:20,169
The origins of public housing are

678
00:23:20,170 --> 00:23:22,509
complex. Again, it was originally

679
00:23:22,510 --> 00:23:23,469
segregated.

680
00:23:23,470 --> 00:23:25,659
And oftentimes governments would bulldoze

681
00:23:25,660 --> 00:23:27,759
the homes of low income people

682
00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:29,319
in order to build this government

683
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:30,489
housing.

684
00:23:30,490 --> 00:23:32,409
But public housing has persisted as one

685
00:23:32,410 --> 00:23:34,479
of the largest and most stable kinds

686
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:36,669
of housing for people who otherwise could

687
00:23:36,670 --> 00:23:39,039
not afford to rent an apartment.

688
00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:41,049
The model of public housing isn't for

689
00:23:41,050 --> 00:23:43,749
profit. It's to house people,

690
00:23:43,750 --> 00:23:45,609
which is one tenet of this concept of

691
00:23:45,610 --> 00:23:47,739
de-growth or post growth that

692
00:23:47,740 --> 00:23:49,059
I didn't mention earlier.

693
00:23:49,060 --> 00:23:50,919
Instead of focusing on growing our

694
00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:53,199
cities, population and economy,

695
00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:55,029
bringing jobs and growing people's

696
00:23:55,030 --> 00:23:57,129
wealth, what have we focused on?

697
00:23:57,130 --> 00:23:59,319
A culture of care, of taking care

698
00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:00,759
of people?

699
00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:01,989
This isn't a new idea.

700
00:24:01,990 --> 00:24:04,119
Plenty of cultures prioritize people

701
00:24:04,120 --> 00:24:05,499
over profits.

702
00:24:05,500 --> 00:24:06,879
But cities in the U.S.

703
00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:09,579
don't. People who run them don't.

704
00:24:09,580 --> 00:24:11,859
Growth machines don't.

705
00:24:11,860 --> 00:24:14,019
Which brings me back to East Austin,

706
00:24:14,020 --> 00:24:16,059
a mile from Rosewood Courts and that

707
00:24:16,060 --> 00:24:18,129
press conference last year over

708
00:24:18,130 --> 00:24:18,519
here.

709
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:21,279
Over on my left, Jessie.

710
00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:22,259
He's a neighbor.

711
00:24:22,260 --> 00:24:24,159
He grew up and he said also down the

712
00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:25,239
street over here.

713
00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:26,709
This is Steve Quiroz.

714
00:24:26,710 --> 00:24:28,749
He had just gotten off of his work shift.

715
00:24:28,750 --> 00:24:30,549
He works for the Texas Facilities

716
00:24:30,550 --> 00:24:32,529
Commission doing maintenance on state

717
00:24:32,530 --> 00:24:33,729
owned buildings.

718
00:24:33,730 --> 00:24:35,049
And then over there, where the yellow

719
00:24:35,050 --> 00:24:36,050
door is,

720
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:41,049
that was my cousin's daughter.

721
00:24:41,050 --> 00:24:43,069
As we stood in his driveway around 6

722
00:24:43,070 --> 00:24:45,129
p.m., sweating our faces off, he

723
00:24:45,130 --> 00:24:47,139
pointed at each house on the block,

724
00:24:47,140 --> 00:24:49,419
drawing me a map of his street.

725
00:24:49,420 --> 00:24:51,509
And then the yellow house.

726
00:24:51,510 --> 00:24:53,010
There's another cousin's daughter,

727
00:24:54,450 --> 00:24:56,519
you know. And then I got another cousin

728
00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:59,009
that lives, like, not in a corner, but

729
00:24:59,010 --> 00:25:00,719
three houses from the corner.

730
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:02,549
Steve lives in East Austin's Holly

731
00:25:02,550 --> 00:25:04,049
neighborhood, just a couple of blocks

732
00:25:04,050 --> 00:25:06,719
from where he grew up in the 1960s.

733
00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:08,639
I lived with my grandparents at their

734
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:09,839
house.

735
00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:11,309
That's where I was raised.

736
00:25:11,310 --> 00:25:12,779
Steve lived in his grandparents house

737
00:25:12,780 --> 00:25:14,759
until about ten years ago, when the rest

738
00:25:14,760 --> 00:25:16,949
of the family decided to sell it.

739
00:25:16,950 --> 00:25:19,079
Steve and his wife later got lucky

740
00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:21,059
and found a house to rent owned by a

741
00:25:21,060 --> 00:25:22,859
local nonprofit.

742
00:25:22,860 --> 00:25:24,899
And then one day, that same nonprofit

743
00:25:24,900 --> 00:25:27,599
asked him if he wanted to buy a house.

744
00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:29,399
Me and my wife, we've been together for

745
00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:30,599
over 30 years and,

746
00:25:32,010 --> 00:25:34,229
you know, and we never really

747
00:25:34,230 --> 00:25:36,569
dreamed of owning our own home.

748
00:25:36,570 --> 00:25:38,910
But but in reality, now

749
00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:42,209
we know that it is our home.

750
00:25:42,210 --> 00:25:43,349
Working a government job.

751
00:25:43,350 --> 00:25:45,029
Steve never thought he'd make enough

752
00:25:45,030 --> 00:25:47,309
money to buy a house in Austin, and

753
00:25:47,310 --> 00:25:49,619
he wasn't wrong on the private market.

754
00:25:49,620 --> 00:25:51,749
Steve probably never could have afforded

755
00:25:51,750 --> 00:25:53,549
a house in Austin.

756
00:25:53,550 --> 00:25:55,769
But this nonprofit, it's called Guadalupe

757
00:25:55,770 --> 00:25:58,109
Neighborhood Development Corporation,

758
00:25:58,110 --> 00:25:59,759
has this housing model that makes it a

759
00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:01,949
lot easier to buy a house and to

760
00:26:01,950 --> 00:26:03,719
stay in that house.

761
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:05,609
It's a thing called a community land

762
00:26:05,610 --> 00:26:06,629
trust.

763
00:26:06,630 --> 00:26:08,819
Mark Rogers runs the nonprofit.

764
00:26:08,820 --> 00:26:10,469
A simple way to describe it in the

765
00:26:10,470 --> 00:26:12,449
traditional sense of community land

766
00:26:12,450 --> 00:26:14,639
trust. The land gets

767
00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:17,279
held by a nonprofit or public entity,

768
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:19,229
and it's leased usually long term.

769
00:26:19,230 --> 00:26:21,719
Typically 99 years to a home buyer.

770
00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:24,869
In Austin, land is so expensive,

771
00:26:24,870 --> 00:26:26,669
a piece of land in the central city with

772
00:26:26,670 --> 00:26:27,599
nothing on it.

773
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:29,879
So no house just vacant

774
00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:32,549
will sell for $200,000

775
00:26:32,550 --> 00:26:34,019
at least.

776
00:26:34,020 --> 00:26:36,089
That's because there's so much demand for

777
00:26:36,090 --> 00:26:38,339
land. So when you buy a house now,

778
00:26:38,340 --> 00:26:40,679
you're mostly paying for the land

779
00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:41,999
with the community land trust.

780
00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:44,129
The land under the house is owned by

781
00:26:44,130 --> 00:26:46,469
the government or nonprofit.

782
00:26:46,470 --> 00:26:48,359
It's taken off the market.

783
00:26:48,360 --> 00:26:50,429
The home buyer buys the house and

784
00:26:50,430 --> 00:26:52,229
rents the land.

785
00:26:52,230 --> 00:26:53,879
Mark stands on the corner and starts

786
00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:55,829
listing the price of homes on this

787
00:26:55,830 --> 00:26:56,489
street.

788
00:26:56,490 --> 00:26:58,321
We were able to sell these for a hundred

789
00:26:58,322 --> 00:27:00,299
thousand, a hundred thousand,

790
00:27:01,350 --> 00:27:02,759
a hundred thousand and 125.

791
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:04,799
$100,000.

792
00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:06,809
You cannot buy a house for that in

793
00:27:06,810 --> 00:27:07,889
Austin.

794
00:27:07,890 --> 00:27:09,749
These homes are set aside for people

795
00:27:09,750 --> 00:27:12,299
earning low incomes and who have ties

796
00:27:12,300 --> 00:27:13,830
to this part of East Austin.

797
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:16,949
And going back to this idea of post

798
00:27:16,950 --> 00:27:19,169
growth of no longer using a city

799
00:27:19,170 --> 00:27:21,299
as a tool for population growth and

800
00:27:21,300 --> 00:27:22,409
wealth.

801
00:27:22,410 --> 00:27:24,479
These homes don't function like so many

802
00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:26,369
homes do in America.

803
00:27:26,370 --> 00:27:28,559
The price of these homes won't go up as

804
00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:29,729
much over time.

805
00:27:29,730 --> 00:27:31,949
You can't buy at one year, turn around

806
00:27:31,950 --> 00:27:34,829
a decade later and sell it to get rich.

807
00:27:34,830 --> 00:27:36,719
So it's not a wealth building tool.

808
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:38,219
If that's the goal, then that's this is

809
00:27:38,220 --> 00:27:39,869
not really the way to go.

810
00:27:39,870 --> 00:27:42,239
But if you want to stay, you know,

811
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:44,399
in central east Austin,

812
00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:46,409
you know, close to jobs opportunities,

813
00:27:46,410 --> 00:27:49,079
close to friends, relatives, family,

814
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:51,179
church, all those things, there's

815
00:27:51,180 --> 00:27:52,199
a great opportunity.

816
00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:53,969
So that's and that's what people see,

817
00:27:53,970 --> 00:27:55,739
basically, you know, it's why these folks

818
00:27:55,740 --> 00:27:56,740
are here.

819
00:27:58,090 --> 00:27:59,859
Back in his living room, sitting on his

820
00:27:59,860 --> 00:28:02,289
couch, Steve says it's the only

821
00:28:02,290 --> 00:28:04,029
reason he can be here.

822
00:28:04,030 --> 00:28:05,409
I don't think I would be in Austin

823
00:28:05,410 --> 00:28:06,700
because it's so expensive.

824
00:28:07,780 --> 00:28:09,939
I hear people that

825
00:28:09,940 --> 00:28:12,129
they paid so much a month

826
00:28:12,130 --> 00:28:14,589
on an apartment, a one bedroom apartment,

827
00:28:14,590 --> 00:28:17,079
and I thought, Wow, you know,

828
00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:19,269
and here I'm blessed with

829
00:28:19,270 --> 00:28:21,699
this home that I pay

830
00:28:21,700 --> 00:28:23,889
maybe twice less than what they pay for

831
00:28:23,890 --> 00:28:24,969
an apartment.

832
00:28:24,970 --> 00:28:26,559
So even his wife had to spend a couple of

833
00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:28,689
years improving their credit scores.

834
00:28:28,690 --> 00:28:30,669
But in 2018, they moved into a three

835
00:28:30,670 --> 00:28:32,919
bedroom, two bathroom house with a small

836
00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:34,149
backyard.

837
00:28:34,150 --> 00:28:36,699
They paid just under $800 a month.

838
00:28:36,700 --> 00:28:39,819
That's mortgage taxes and insurance.

839
00:28:39,820 --> 00:28:41,679
Zillow reports that the average mortgage

840
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:43,809
payment in the Austin area is more

841
00:28:43,810 --> 00:28:45,669
than two times that.

842
00:28:45,670 --> 00:28:47,799
The thing is that I never really owned

843
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:49,899
a home and this was

844
00:28:49,900 --> 00:28:51,250
my first home that I owned.

845
00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:54,700
And I this really mine.

846
00:28:55,790 --> 00:28:58,059
And, you know, and then things

847
00:28:58,060 --> 00:28:59,229
go through my head and

848
00:29:00,370 --> 00:29:02,049
maybe they'll tell me, no, you're not

849
00:29:02,050 --> 00:29:04,119
qualified or whatever.

850
00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:06,129
But, you know, it was already said and

851
00:29:06,130 --> 00:29:08,589
done. And we had signed the papers

852
00:29:08,590 --> 00:29:10,570
and we knew it was ours already.

853
00:29:17,170 --> 00:29:19,239
Steve's house is lofted so you can

854
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:21,369
stand on the second floor and look down

855
00:29:21,370 --> 00:29:23,859
into the living room and the kitchen.

856
00:29:23,860 --> 00:29:26,259
At first we couldn't believe

857
00:29:26,260 --> 00:29:28,359
it. I would go upstairs and look

858
00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,059
down and say, Man, is this really ours?

859
00:29:31,060 --> 00:29:33,009
And we got used to it.

860
00:29:33,010 --> 00:29:35,169
And like I said, we love it.

861
00:29:35,170 --> 00:29:36,909
Community land trusts are just one way to

862
00:29:36,910 --> 00:29:39,249
house people outside of a for profit

863
00:29:39,250 --> 00:29:41,589
market, and they're not perfect

864
00:29:41,590 --> 00:29:43,779
for one. In most cases, people still

865
00:29:43,780 --> 00:29:45,579
have to qualify for a traditional

866
00:29:45,580 --> 00:29:47,739
mortgage, which is really hard

867
00:29:47,740 --> 00:29:50,319
if you don't earn a big income.

868
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:52,419
But Steve says it's the reason he

869
00:29:52,420 --> 00:29:54,399
can afford to stay in Austin.

870
00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:56,859
We grew up here and

871
00:29:56,860 --> 00:29:57,970
you know, our heart is here.

872
00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:06,759
Public housing, Community Land trust.

873
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:08,679
These are all parts of a solution to our

874
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:11,019
housing affordability problem.

875
00:30:11,020 --> 00:30:12,669
But these are things that in our current

876
00:30:12,670 --> 00:30:15,339
system only help a few people.

877
00:30:15,340 --> 00:30:17,529
Right now, about 6% of homes

878
00:30:17,530 --> 00:30:19,839
in Austin are subsidized.

879
00:30:19,840 --> 00:30:21,549
We can change that by funding more

880
00:30:21,550 --> 00:30:23,709
government or nonprofit housing.

881
00:30:23,710 --> 00:30:25,689
But the current reality is that most of

882
00:30:25,690 --> 00:30:27,909
us, the vast majority of us, live

883
00:30:27,910 --> 00:30:29,949
in private housing.

884
00:30:29,950 --> 00:30:32,169
Maybe there's little we can do now about

885
00:30:32,170 --> 00:30:34,119
all the people moving here.

886
00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:35,649
But studies show that building more

887
00:30:35,650 --> 00:30:37,749
housing will keep prices from going

888
00:30:37,750 --> 00:30:39,909
up and up and up like

889
00:30:39,910 --> 00:30:41,319
they've been doing.

890
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:42,729
For better or for worse.

891
00:30:42,730 --> 00:30:45,399
Austin's growth machine did its job.

892
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:47,559
Ignoring the results doesn't seem

893
00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:48,819
like it's worked very well.

894
00:30:53,730 --> 00:30:56,069
Throughout the series, I kept wondering

895
00:30:56,070 --> 00:30:58,079
what if Austin could go back and do it

896
00:30:58,080 --> 00:30:59,609
all over again?

897
00:30:59,610 --> 00:31:01,799
Is there a middle ground, a space between

898
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:03,959
growing like crazy and dying as

899
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:05,279
a city?

900
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:07,259
And can some other place figure that out?

901
00:31:20,630 --> 00:31:22,669
Drive 30 minutes north of Austin and

902
00:31:22,670 --> 00:31:25,399
you'll find yourself in a cornfield.

903
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:27,589
Soon you'll see something rising

904
00:31:27,590 --> 00:31:28,759
in the distance.

905
00:31:28,760 --> 00:31:31,339
You can see the sea of cranes out to

906
00:31:31,340 --> 00:31:32,569
the southwest.

907
00:31:32,570 --> 00:31:34,849
At least two dozen yellow building cranes

908
00:31:34,850 --> 00:31:37,459
tower over this flat land.

909
00:31:37,460 --> 00:31:40,149
If you build it, will they come?

910
00:31:40,150 --> 00:31:41,200
What are the -- what's that being built
out there?

911
00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:45,200
That is Samsung.

912
00:31:45,870 --> 00:31:47,679
All Samsung.

913
00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:49,269
This is Brandt Rydell.

914
00:31:49,270 --> 00:31:51,399
You see, when the big chipmaking company,

915
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:53,889
Samsung, chose not to expand its campus

916
00:31:53,890 --> 00:31:56,469
in Austin, it chose to open a factory

917
00:31:56,470 --> 00:31:59,049
just outside the city of Taylor.

918
00:31:59,050 --> 00:32:01,149
And this place is huge.

919
00:32:01,150 --> 00:32:03,009
Or it will be when they finish building

920
00:32:03,010 --> 00:32:04,269
it in a year.

921
00:32:04,270 --> 00:32:05,739
Next to the construction site is a

922
00:32:05,740 --> 00:32:07,959
parking lot fit for an airport

923
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:10,029
full of trailers For all the contractors

924
00:32:10,030 --> 00:32:12,009
working to build millions and millions of

925
00:32:12,010 --> 00:32:13,899
square feet of factory.

926
00:32:13,900 --> 00:32:15,459
Keep in mind, there is over 1200 acres

927
00:32:15,460 --> 00:32:17,709
here that Samsung owns.

928
00:32:17,710 --> 00:32:20,649
This development is less than 20%

929
00:32:20,650 --> 00:32:21,999
of the overall acreage.

930
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,459
And so what Samsung has

931
00:32:24,460 --> 00:32:26,680
filed with the state that potentially.

932
00:32:28,570 --> 00:32:30,789
There would be five of these buildings

933
00:32:30,790 --> 00:32:32,919
here, not just one 10 million

934
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:34,522
square foot building, but five of them.

935
00:32:36,705 --> 00:32:37,499
So, 50 million square feet.

936
00:32:37,500 --> 00:32:39,599
And then ten, potentially,

937
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:41,549
ten semi-conductor fabs.

938
00:32:42,550 --> 00:32:44,739
I undersold Brandt a bit earlier.

939
00:32:44,740 --> 00:32:47,079
He's actually the mayor of Taylor.

940
00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:49,029
And a development this big is kind of

941
00:32:49,030 --> 00:32:51,459
wild in the town he oversees.

942
00:32:51,460 --> 00:32:53,889
It's small. About 18,000 people

943
00:32:53,890 --> 00:32:55,029
live in Taylor.

944
00:32:55,030 --> 00:32:57,099
The population here has doubled since

945
00:32:57,100 --> 00:32:58,389
1950.

946
00:32:58,390 --> 00:33:00,789
Over 70 years ago, Austin's

947
00:33:00,790 --> 00:33:03,729
population doubles about every 20 years.

948
00:33:03,730 --> 00:33:05,049
Brandt grew up in Taylor.

949
00:33:05,050 --> 00:33:06,819
He went to Arkansas for college and then

950
00:33:06,820 --> 00:33:08,889
Austin for law school, and

951
00:33:08,890 --> 00:33:10,599
he never imagined he'd come back to his

952
00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:11,739
hometown.

953
00:33:11,740 --> 00:33:13,989
There were limited opportunities

954
00:33:13,990 --> 00:33:16,269
to come back to Taylor and

955
00:33:16,270 --> 00:33:18,609
to build a life and raise

956
00:33:18,610 --> 00:33:19,549
a family.

957
00:33:19,550 --> 00:33:21,699
And like many small towns,

958
00:33:21,700 --> 00:33:23,499
we saw leakage.

959
00:33:23,500 --> 00:33:25,749
We lose these kids never to return.

960
00:33:25,750 --> 00:33:27,339
But Brandt came back to Taylor in the

961
00:33:27,340 --> 00:33:28,899
early 2000s.

962
00:33:28,900 --> 00:33:30,819
He actually works for ERCOT, the Electric

963
00:33:30,820 --> 00:33:33,159
Reliability Council of Texas.

964
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:34,689
The people we were all mad at during the

965
00:33:34,690 --> 00:33:36,549
2021 freeze.

966
00:33:36,550 --> 00:33:38,769
Anyway, when Brandt came back to Taylor,

967
00:33:38,770 --> 00:33:40,209
he didn't like what he saw.

968
00:33:40,210 --> 00:33:42,189
It was very much the town that I'd left

969
00:33:42,190 --> 00:33:43,489
in 1989.

970
00:33:43,490 --> 00:33:45,669
Not a lot had changed, but the more

971
00:33:45,670 --> 00:33:46,959
I reflected on it, that wasn't

972
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:49,149
necessarily a good thing, because so

973
00:33:49,150 --> 00:33:51,429
much had changed in central Texas.

974
00:33:51,430 --> 00:33:53,769
And Taylor really

975
00:33:53,770 --> 00:33:55,719
seemed to have been stuck in time.

976
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:57,849
And I see

977
00:33:57,850 --> 00:33:59,529
that as one way of being preserved in

978
00:33:59,530 --> 00:34:01,269
amber. A lot of things were protected and

979
00:34:01,270 --> 00:34:03,219
saved, but then there were certain things

980
00:34:03,220 --> 00:34:05,919
that had not progressed that I thought

981
00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:07,569
needed to happen in Taylor.

982
00:34:07,570 --> 00:34:09,698
And it was a little disquieting

983
00:34:09,699 --> 00:34:11,799
that Taylor didn't seem to

984
00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:14,198
be taking steps forward.

985
00:34:14,199 --> 00:34:16,209
Brandt says this idea of keeping Taylor

986
00:34:16,210 --> 00:34:18,428
the way it's always been goes back

987
00:34:18,429 --> 00:34:19,959
more than half a century.

988
00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:22,359
Go back to the old story about I-35 being

989
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:24,968
planned to potentially come

990
00:34:24,969 --> 00:34:27,218
to the west side of Taylor between Taylor

991
00:34:27,219 --> 00:34:28,839
and Hutto and everything that that would

992
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:30,999
bring during that time period.

993
00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:33,129
And, you know, if the

994
00:34:33,130 --> 00:34:34,178
stories are to be believed, the

995
00:34:34,179 --> 00:34:36,309
leadership at the time didn't want that

996
00:34:36,310 --> 00:34:38,109
disruption, one, to keep things the way

997
00:34:38,110 --> 00:34:40,238
they were in. TAYLOR And so push that off

998
00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:42,309
to Round Rock and Georgetown

999
00:34:42,310 --> 00:34:44,408
and let us kind of do what we

1000
00:34:44,409 --> 00:34:46,238
do here in Taylor and just maintain

1001
00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:47,379
status quo.

1002
00:34:47,380 --> 00:34:49,509
So that's always been part of Taylor's

1003
00:34:49,510 --> 00:34:51,309
psychology. Let's just keep things the

1004
00:34:51,310 --> 00:34:52,238
way they are.

1005
00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:54,309
And if Brandt's to be believed, this is

1006
00:34:54,310 --> 00:34:55,329
not a good thing.

1007
00:34:55,330 --> 00:34:56,440
I know some people

1008
00:34:57,850 --> 00:34:59,589
like that notion, but it's not realistic.

1009
00:34:59,590 --> 00:35:01,329
Things are always going to be changing.

1010
00:35:01,330 --> 00:35:02,919
And so as a leader in Taylor, I have to

1011
00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:05,199
look, I'm not worried about

1012
00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:07,329
it today or next week or even

1013
00:35:07,330 --> 00:35:08,769
next year. I have to look out for the

1014
00:35:08,770 --> 00:35:10,839
best interests of the community and, you

1015
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:12,819
know, in terms of decades of generations.

1016
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:18,849
And so when Brandt got a call in early

1017
00:35:18,850 --> 00:35:21,429
2021, he thought, "here's Taylor's

1018
00:35:21,430 --> 00:35:23,319
future." The call was coming from the

1019
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,629
judge who oversees Williamson County,

1020
00:35:25,630 --> 00:35:27,369
the county that Taylor's in.

1021
00:35:27,370 --> 00:35:28,989
I was already on my second bourbon of the

1022
00:35:28,990 --> 00:35:31,089
night by the time he called

1023
00:35:31,090 --> 00:35:33,219
me and he said, Mayor, I don't know

1024
00:35:33,220 --> 00:35:35,109
if you've heard that there's this

1025
00:35:35,110 --> 00:35:37,209
economic development project

1026
00:35:37,210 --> 00:35:39,369
that is looking

1027
00:35:39,370 --> 00:35:41,619
for a site.

1028
00:35:41,620 --> 00:35:43,749
And your economic

1029
00:35:43,750 --> 00:35:46,659
development director has proposed

1030
00:35:46,660 --> 00:35:47,889
Taylor as a potential site.

1031
00:35:50,710 --> 00:35:51,969
He didn't know it at the time, but the

1032
00:35:51,970 --> 00:35:54,309
project was Samsung's next big chip

1033
00:35:54,310 --> 00:35:56,079
making factory again.

1034
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:57,399
Chips are the things you need for

1035
00:35:57,400 --> 00:35:59,199
computers to run.

1036
00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:00,789
It's not a tech podcast.

1037
00:36:00,790 --> 00:36:02,859
It's 2,000 jobs

1038
00:36:02,860 --> 00:36:05,319
and it's $17 billion

1039
00:36:05,320 --> 00:36:06,320
of investment.

1040
00:36:07,570 --> 00:36:09,459
And like I said, I was on my second

1041
00:36:09,460 --> 00:36:12,729
whiskey of the night and I thought,

1042
00:36:12,730 --> 00:36:14,709
I know I didn't hear this right because

1043
00:36:14,710 --> 00:36:16,809
he said 2,000 jobs, which

1044
00:36:16,810 --> 00:36:19,059
is for Taylor, that would be easily

1045
00:36:19,060 --> 00:36:21,429
double the largest employer in town.

1046
00:36:21,430 --> 00:36:23,469
I think we can all agree that Brandt is

1047
00:36:23,470 --> 00:36:25,899
part of Taylor's growth machine,

1048
00:36:25,900 --> 00:36:27,819
and the machine thinks what a great

1049
00:36:27,820 --> 00:36:30,039
opportunity to bring all these jobs

1050
00:36:30,040 --> 00:36:31,209
to Taylor.

1051
00:36:31,210 --> 00:36:32,769
We can really juice up the town's

1052
00:36:32,770 --> 00:36:33,909
economy.

1053
00:36:33,910 --> 00:36:35,889
So Brandt starts pitching Taylor.

1054
00:36:35,890 --> 00:36:37,959
"Pick us, pick us." Kind of like

1055
00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:40,539
that MCC thing in Austin.

1056
00:36:40,540 --> 00:36:42,129
Quail. The private jet.

1057
00:36:42,130 --> 00:36:43,959
Though Brandt's pitch is a little more

1058
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:44,769
modest.

1059
00:36:44,770 --> 00:36:45,999
Taylor, we're really kind of a blue

1060
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:47,799
collar, working class community,

1061
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:48,789
historically speaking.

1062
00:36:48,790 --> 00:36:51,519
You know, a city of

1063
00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:53,349
-- you know, it was founded by, you know,

1064
00:36:53,350 --> 00:36:55,839
the railroad. But we're really built by,

1065
00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:56,889
you know, immigrants.

1066
00:36:56,890 --> 00:36:58,989
And and, you know, we

1067
00:36:58,990 --> 00:37:01,419
were a town of of of industry,

1068
00:37:01,420 --> 00:37:03,279
you know, with the rail here.

1069
00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:05,389
And one time we were characterized as

1070
00:37:05,390 --> 00:37:07,149
the largest inland cotton market in the

1071
00:37:07,150 --> 00:37:08,499
world, had the largest bedding

1072
00:37:08,500 --> 00:37:10,449
manufacturer in the world here just right

1073
00:37:10,450 --> 00:37:12,609
down the street, that that was part

1074
00:37:12,610 --> 00:37:14,019
of our history.

1075
00:37:14,020 --> 00:37:16,689
And I think I did touch on the fact that,

1076
00:37:16,690 --> 00:37:18,879
you know, Taylor had this glorious

1077
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:20,169
past.

1078
00:37:20,170 --> 00:37:21,959
It's been in a

1079
00:37:23,050 --> 00:37:25,149
hit, a point of stasis now for

1080
00:37:25,150 --> 00:37:27,159
for a time. But, you know, it was ready

1081
00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:29,229
to kind of step forward again

1082
00:37:29,230 --> 00:37:31,389
and kind of be a leader in terms of

1083
00:37:32,620 --> 00:37:34,359
with the semiconductor industry if if

1084
00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:36,039
Samsung would come here.

1085
00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:38,110
This was his bed sheet moment.

1086
00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:40,749
Well, thank you, everybody, for being

1087
00:37:40,750 --> 00:37:41,750
here.

1088
00:37:42,190 --> 00:37:44,799
I'm proud to welcome

1089
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:46,869
Dr. Kim to the Texas

1090
00:37:46,870 --> 00:37:47,889
governor's mansion.

1091
00:37:47,890 --> 00:37:49,659
And two days before Thanksgiving, it was

1092
00:37:49,660 --> 00:37:50,769
official.

1093
00:37:50,770 --> 00:37:52,989
After a thorough and

1094
00:37:52,990 --> 00:37:55,089
comprehensive search,

1095
00:37:55,090 --> 00:37:57,489
Samsung has chosen Taylor,

1096
00:37:57,490 --> 00:37:59,739
Texas, as the site of

1097
00:37:59,740 --> 00:38:01,406
its new state of the art semiconductor

1098
00:38:03,430 --> 00:38:05,349
chip fabrication plant.

1099
00:38:07,930 --> 00:38:10,029
The city of Taylor offered Samsung some

1100
00:38:10,030 --> 00:38:11,559
big tax breaks.

1101
00:38:11,560 --> 00:38:13,749
The company will pay just 7% of

1102
00:38:13,750 --> 00:38:16,509
their city taxes for the first decade,

1103
00:38:16,510 --> 00:38:18,489
which on a multibillion dollar project

1104
00:38:18,490 --> 00:38:20,769
could mean a lot of money for Taylor,

1105
00:38:20,770 --> 00:38:22,479
even if it's just a fraction of what the

1106
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:24,459
company would normally pay.

1107
00:38:24,460 --> 00:38:26,529
Overall, the community is very excited

1108
00:38:26,530 --> 00:38:28,929
about the prospects for Taylor

1109
00:38:28,930 --> 00:38:31,749
with something like this project here,

1110
00:38:31,750 --> 00:38:34,089
but that is also tempered with, you know,

1111
00:38:34,090 --> 00:38:36,159
the understandable

1112
00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:38,409
fears and concerns about,

1113
00:38:38,410 --> 00:38:39,579
okay, what is this mean?

1114
00:38:39,580 --> 00:38:41,020
I mean, this is a big change.

1115
00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:44,999
When I talk to people in Taylor, the

1116
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:46,379
reaction was mixed.

1117
00:38:46,380 --> 00:38:48,539
Some were excited that bringing more jobs

1118
00:38:48,540 --> 00:38:50,759
could mean more shops, more people, more

1119
00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:53,249
things to do in this small town.

1120
00:38:53,250 --> 00:38:55,079
Others worried what a big international

1121
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:56,999
company would mean for their everyday

1122
00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:59,609
lives for the cost of housing.

1123
00:38:59,610 --> 00:39:01,529
But housing was getting more expensive in

1124
00:39:01,530 --> 00:39:03,839
Taylor before Samsung prices

1125
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:05,969
started going up in 2020, as they did

1126
00:39:05,970 --> 00:39:07,469
across the country.

1127
00:39:07,470 --> 00:39:09,659
And now homes sell for 50% more

1128
00:39:09,660 --> 00:39:12,419
than they did just three years earlier.

1129
00:39:12,420 --> 00:39:14,069
Why? A lot of people moving to Williamson

1130
00:39:14,070 --> 00:39:16,319
County are coming from Austin.

1131
00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:18,209
Historically, they haven't really gone to

1132
00:39:18,210 --> 00:39:19,859
Taylor. They've gone to Round Rock and

1133
00:39:19,860 --> 00:39:21,149
Georgetown.

1134
00:39:21,150 --> 00:39:23,249
Brandt says that's changing.

1135
00:39:23,250 --> 00:39:24,509
Even without Samsung, we figured the

1136
00:39:24,510 --> 00:39:25,979
population of the town is going to double

1137
00:39:25,980 --> 00:39:28,139
by 2040, maybe earlier than that

1138
00:39:28,140 --> 00:39:28,649
now.

1139
00:39:28,650 --> 00:39:30,209
The week before Samsung was announced,

1140
00:39:30,210 --> 00:39:32,129
Brandt and his colleagues approved a new

1141
00:39:32,130 --> 00:39:33,569
vision plan for Taylor.

1142
00:39:33,570 --> 00:39:35,699
Basically, how should the city change

1143
00:39:35,700 --> 00:39:37,739
to accommodate all the people they expect

1144
00:39:37,740 --> 00:39:39,239
to move here?

1145
00:39:39,240 --> 00:39:41,009
You'll remember Austin did the same thing

1146
00:39:41,010 --> 00:39:42,569
in 2012.

1147
00:39:42,570 --> 00:39:44,909
Anyway, Taylor's plan calls for building

1148
00:39:44,910 --> 00:39:47,999
inward, not outward, so not sprawling

1149
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:49,919
and building homes closer together.

1150
00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:52,079
More duplexes, small apartment

1151
00:39:52,080 --> 00:39:54,899
buildings among the single family homes.

1152
00:39:54,900 --> 00:39:57,269
Taylor not growing, was never

1153
00:39:57,270 --> 00:39:58,199
going to be an option.

1154
00:39:58,200 --> 00:39:59,579
Taylor was going to grow.

1155
00:39:59,580 --> 00:40:01,500
How was it going to grow?

1156
00:40:02,610 --> 00:40:04,050
Why was it never an option?

1157
00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:07,139
Why was not growing?

1158
00:40:07,140 --> 00:40:09,179
Well, I think Austin just being the

1159
00:40:09,180 --> 00:40:11,369
dynamic force, it is that

1160
00:40:11,370 --> 00:40:12,689
and the magnet

1161
00:40:14,070 --> 00:40:16,379
that it's become that

1162
00:40:16,380 --> 00:40:17,429
Taylor was going to grow.

1163
00:40:17,430 --> 00:40:19,199
This is it at central Texas is an

1164
00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:21,569
attractive area for people to want to be.

1165
00:40:21,570 --> 00:40:22,709
So Taylor was going to grow.

1166
00:40:22,710 --> 00:40:24,869
And as it grows, Brandt says, the city,

1167
00:40:24,870 --> 00:40:27,089
the residents can have more of a say in

1168
00:40:27,090 --> 00:40:28,769
how it changes.

1169
00:40:28,770 --> 00:40:31,559
Samsung provides some amount of leverage

1170
00:40:31,560 --> 00:40:33,779
for Taylor because before

1171
00:40:33,780 --> 00:40:35,999
a presence like Samsung in Taylor, when

1172
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:37,619
I would talk to developers and we'd say,

1173
00:40:37,620 --> 00:40:39,149
"Hey, look, here's our expectation of

1174
00:40:39,150 --> 00:40:41,279
what you what you would bring to

1175
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:42,280
Taylor".

1176
00:40:42,810 --> 00:40:44,279
The reaction would be like, "You're just

1177
00:40:44,280 --> 00:40:45,280
Taylor.

1178
00:40:45,930 --> 00:40:47,849
Who are you to tell us what you want?

1179
00:40:47,850 --> 00:40:49,919
You're lucky to have anything coming to

1180
00:40:49,920 --> 00:40:51,449
Taylor." So this is what we're telling

1181
00:40:51,450 --> 00:40:53,609
you we were going to do.

1182
00:40:53,610 --> 00:40:55,799
And you should be happy that we're even

1183
00:40:55,800 --> 00:40:56,459
doing this.

1184
00:40:56,460 --> 00:40:58,439
Brandt emailed me weeks ago to say he

1185
00:40:58,440 --> 00:40:59,909
like the podcast.

1186
00:40:59,910 --> 00:41:01,979
Guys: He's a machinehead.

1187
00:41:01,980 --> 00:41:04,049
Anyway, I realized I really

1188
00:41:04,050 --> 00:41:06,389
wanted to talk to him about Taylor,

1189
00:41:06,390 --> 00:41:08,519
about how he's considering this really

1190
00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:10,739
pivotal moment in the town's story

1191
00:41:10,740 --> 00:41:12,869
and how people are reacting to his

1192
00:41:12,870 --> 00:41:14,189
vision of Taylor.

1193
00:41:14,190 --> 00:41:16,289
A lot of my detractors and people aren't

1194
00:41:16,290 --> 00:41:17,669
fans of mine.

1195
00:41:17,670 --> 00:41:20,399
They say, Don't Austin my Taylor

1196
00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:21,419
and I think a lot of the things I'm

1197
00:41:21,420 --> 00:41:23,669
doing, not the least of which

1198
00:41:23,670 --> 00:41:25,529
is being instrumental in helping bring

1199
00:41:25,530 --> 00:41:28,229
Samsung to Taylor is

1200
00:41:28,230 --> 00:41:30,779
Austin izing Taylor.

1201
00:41:30,780 --> 00:41:32,879
But what I think of Don't ask me Taylor I

1202
00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:34,649
think look, we're adopting this covers of

1203
00:41:34,650 --> 00:41:37,109
plan and we're looking forward for

1204
00:41:37,110 --> 00:41:38,519
the growth and development of how we're

1205
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:40,709
going to shepherd those forces and

1206
00:41:40,710 --> 00:41:43,139
mold things where to the best

1207
00:41:43,140 --> 00:41:46,589
of our ability, we're able to retain

1208
00:41:46,590 --> 00:41:48,089
the sense of community.

1209
00:41:48,090 --> 00:41:49,889
It's not going to be the same community,

1210
00:41:49,890 --> 00:41:52,259
but that feel

1211
00:41:52,260 --> 00:41:54,570
that we all appreciate about Taylor.

1212
00:41:59,500 --> 00:42:01,629
Is there anything that that you've

1213
00:42:01,630 --> 00:42:02,769
learned from Austin?

1214
00:42:04,570 --> 00:42:06,460
I look back and I know that

1215
00:42:07,510 --> 00:42:09,819
what's almost a stereotypical

1216
00:42:09,820 --> 00:42:12,729
Austin mind says, "Hey, hey, wait,

1217
00:42:12,730 --> 00:42:13,969
you should have been here ten years ago.

1218
00:42:13,970 --> 00:42:15,109
And, you know, about 20 years ago.

1219
00:42:15,110 --> 00:42:17,349
I was really great then." And, "hey,

1220
00:42:17,350 --> 00:42:18,399
we just don't want you to change.

1221
00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:21,459
We want to keep Austin as it is."

1222
00:42:21,460 --> 00:42:23,739
And I mean, and I

1223
00:42:23,740 --> 00:42:24,759
think of Taylor.

1224
00:42:24,760 --> 00:42:26,199
There's that same mindset we would want

1225
00:42:26,200 --> 00:42:27,429
to keep Taylor as it is.

1226
00:42:27,430 --> 00:42:29,799
Well, there are going to be forces

1227
00:42:29,800 --> 00:42:32,199
at work that are going to just run over

1228
00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:34,119
that that mindset.

1229
00:42:34,120 --> 00:42:35,800
And you can try to

1230
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:38,000
resist it

1231
00:42:39,190 --> 00:42:41,619
and build walls and try to prevent

1232
00:42:41,620 --> 00:42:43,299
it as much as you can.

1233
00:42:43,300 --> 00:42:44,300
At some point

1234
00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:46,819
those are going to be breached and you're

1235
00:42:46,820 --> 00:42:48,819
going be overrun and you have spent so

1236
00:42:48,820 --> 00:42:51,399
much time focusing on stopping

1237
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:53,469
those forces that you haven't thought

1238
00:42:53,470 --> 00:42:56,349
about how can I manage

1239
00:42:56,350 --> 00:42:58,629
those and shape them and route

1240
00:42:58,630 --> 00:43:00,699
those in a certain way that is

1241
00:43:00,700 --> 00:43:02,799
going to change the town, but

1242
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:05,229
it will benefit us

1243
00:43:05,230 --> 00:43:07,389
long term where we don't

1244
00:43:07,390 --> 00:43:08,859
just get stuck in our ways and say

1245
00:43:08,860 --> 00:43:10,269
absolutely not perfect, going to fight

1246
00:43:10,270 --> 00:43:11,800
this fight is going to fight this,

1247
00:43:12,880 --> 00:43:15,339
and then you lose that fight

1248
00:43:15,340 --> 00:43:18,219
you.

1249
00:43:25,030 --> 00:43:27,579
It's easy for Brandt to criticize Austin,

1250
00:43:27,580 --> 00:43:29,559
to say Taylor will do better.

1251
00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:31,719
Taylor will figure out some middle road.

1252
00:43:31,720 --> 00:43:33,819
It'll figure out how to bring more jobs,

1253
00:43:33,820 --> 00:43:36,249
more people build his economy,

1254
00:43:36,250 --> 00:43:38,439
and also make sure it stays a place

1255
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:40,539
where anyone who wants to can afford

1256
00:43:40,540 --> 00:43:41,919
to live.

1257
00:43:41,920 --> 00:43:44,379
Maybe our two options were never grow,

1258
00:43:44,380 --> 00:43:46,359
grow, grow or die.

1259
00:43:46,360 --> 00:43:48,339
Maybe there was a third option we failed

1260
00:43:48,340 --> 00:43:50,439
to see grow in a way

1261
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:52,659
that was good for everyone or good

1262
00:43:52,660 --> 00:43:54,069
for most people.

1263
00:43:54,070 --> 00:43:56,559
A way that means necessary change.

1264
00:43:56,560 --> 00:43:58,029
Maybe that even means your own

1265
00:43:58,030 --> 00:44:00,099
neighborhood changes, but it's

1266
00:44:00,100 --> 00:44:03,069
a change that prioritizes people.

1267
00:44:03,070 --> 00:44:05,859
Austin has a culture of nostalgia.

1268
00:44:05,860 --> 00:44:06,789
You know that whole thing.

1269
00:44:06,790 --> 00:44:08,709
Austin was better right before you got

1270
00:44:08,710 --> 00:44:10,779
here. The bumper stickers that say,

1271
00:44:10,780 --> 00:44:12,909
Don't California, my Austin, don't

1272
00:44:12,910 --> 00:44:14,169
move here.

1273
00:44:14,170 --> 00:44:16,689
At some point, the ethos of Austin became

1274
00:44:16,690 --> 00:44:18,429
resisting change.

1275
00:44:18,430 --> 00:44:21,039
And yet the change came anyway.

1276
00:44:21,040 --> 00:44:22,209
And lots of it.

1277
00:44:23,310 --> 00:44:25,619
And now we have a new bumper sticker.

1278
00:44:25,620 --> 00:44:27,510
Don't Austin My Taylor.

1279
00:44:32,110 --> 00:44:34,269
This has been Growth Machine: How Austin

1280
00:44:34,270 --> 00:44:36,609
Engineered its Housing Market. Growth

1281
00:44:36,610 --> 00:44:39,069
Machine is a production of KUT and KUTX

1282
00:44:39,070 --> 00:44:40,809
Studios in Austin.

1283
00:44:40,810 --> 00:44:43,029
It's produced by me, Jimmy Maas, Mose

1284
00:44:43,030 --> 00:44:45,219
Buchele, Marisa Charpentier, Nathan

1285
00:44:45,220 --> 00:44:47,109
Bernier and Matt Largey.

1286
00:44:47,110 --> 00:44:48,969
Production help from Heather Stewart.

1287
00:44:48,970 --> 00:44:51,069
Technical help from Jake Perlman and Rene

1288
00:44:51,070 --> 00:44:52,149
Chavez.

1289
00:44:52,150 --> 00:44:54,969
Stephanie Federico is our digital editor.

1290
00:44:54,970 --> 00:44:57,189
Special thanks to Susan Paulson, Carmen

1291
00:44:57,190 --> 00:44:59,949
Llanes Pulido and Edgar Handle.

1292
00:44:59,950 --> 00:45:00,950
There's more at KUT dot org slash Growth

1293
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:03,549
Machine.

1294
00:45:03,550 --> 00:45:05,019
I'm Audrey McGlinchy.

1295
00:45:05,020 --> 00:45:06,789
Thank you so much for listening.

1296
00:45:06,790 --> 00:45:07,790
That's all for now.